Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry

[Brent Kimberley]

Hi.
Can anyone point me to some methods to benchmark and/or audit Kerberos v5?

For example, SSH:
Manual
Read the RFCs and specs.
Semi-automatic.
jtesta/ssh-audit: SSH server & client security auditing (banner, key exchange, encryption, mac, compression, compatibility, security, etc) (github.com)<https://github.com/jtesta/ssh-audit/>
Automatic
SSH Configuration Auditor (ssh-audit.com)<https://www.ssh-audit.com/>


TLS example upon request.

THIS MESSAGE IS FOR THE USE OF THE INTENDED RECIPIENT(S) ONLY AND MAY CONTAIN INFORMATION THAT IS PRIVILEGED, PROPRIETARY, CONFIDENTIAL, AND/OR EXEMPT FROM DISCLOSURE UNDER ANY RELEVANT PRIVACY LEGISLATION. No rights to any privilege have been waived. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, re-transmission, dissemination, distribution, copying, conversion to hard copy, taking of action in reliance on or other use of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient and have received this message in error, please notify me by return e-mail and delete or destroy all copies of this message.

[Brent Kimberley]

Preferably something smaller and more focused than nmap or OpenSCAP. 😉

From: Brent Kimberley
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2024 12:44 PM
To: ***@mit.edu
Subject: Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry

Hi.
Can anyone point me to some methods to benchmark and/or audit Kerberos v5?

For example, SSH:
Manual
Read the RFCs and specs.
Semi-automatic.
jtesta/ssh-audit: SSH server & client security auditing (banner, key exchange, encryption, mac, compression, compatibility, security, etc) (github.com)<https://github.com/jtesta/ssh-audit/>
Automatic
SSH Configuration Auditor (ssh-audit.com)<https://www.ssh-audit.com/>


TLS example upon request.

THIS MESSAGE IS FOR THE USE OF THE INTENDED RECIPIENT(S) ONLY AND MAY CONTAIN INFORMATION THAT IS PRIVILEGED, PROPRIETARY, CONFIDENTIAL, AND/OR EXEMPT FROM DISCLOSURE UNDER ANY RELEVANT PRIVACY LEGISLATION. No rights to any privilege have been waived. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, re-transmission, dissemination, distribution, copying, conversion to hard copy, taking of action in reliance on or other use of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient and have received this message in error, please notify me by return e-m

[Christopher D. Clausen]

I have used this as a guide, but I think MIT Kerberos version 1.10 is
the latest available:
https://www.cisecurity.org/benchmark/mit_kerberos

Not sure if this is what you are looking for or not.

<<CDC

Post by Brent Kimberley
Preferably something smaller and more focused than nmap or OpenSCAP. 😉
From: Brent Kimberley
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2024 12:44 PM
Subject: Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry
Hi.
Can anyone point me to some methods to benchmark and/or audit Kerberos v5?
Manual
Read the RFCs and specs.
Semi-automatic.
jtesta/ssh-audit: SSH server & client security auditing (banner, key exchange, encryption, mac, compression, compatibility, security, etc) (github.com)<https://github.com/jtesta/ssh-audit/>
Automatic
SSH Configuration Auditor (ssh-audit.com)<https://www.ssh-audit.com/>
TLS example upon request.

[Brent Kimberley]

Hi Christopher.

Yes. You are correct. Peer reviewed installation readiness documents like the CIS MIT benchmark are a good "first step."

I was asking pointers to the rest of the lifecycle suite - specifically "walk".

Crawl
=====
Installation readiness documents
e.g., CIS MIT Kerberos Benchmark

Walk
====
Focused applications.

Application which can connect to a client or a server and emit:
Enabled ciphers.
Enabled MACs.
Enabled Kerberos modes (krb5, krb5i, krb5p)
etc.

Background: most sites appear to be misconfigured.

Run
====
A focused service.


-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher D. Clausen <***@acm.org>
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2024 2:10 PM
To: Brent Kimberley <***@Durham.ca>; ***@mit.edu
Subject: Re: Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry

[You don't often get email from ***@acm.org. Learn why this is important at https://aka.ms/LearnAboutSenderIdentification ]

I have used this as a guide, but I think MIT Kerberos version 1.10 is the latest available:
https://www.cisecurity.org/benchmark/mit_kerberos

Not sure if this is what you are looking for or not.

<<CDC

Post by Brent Kimberley
Preferably something smaller and more focused than nmap or OpenSCAP. 😉
From: Brent Kimberley
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2024 12:44 PM
Subject: Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry
Hi.
Can anyone point me to some methods to benchmark and/or audit Kerberos v5?
Manual
Read the RFCs and specs.
Semi-automatic.
jtesta/ssh-audit: SSH server & client security auditing (banner, key exchange, encryption, mac, compression, compatibility, security, etc) (github.com)<https://github.com/jtesta/ssh-audit/>
Automatic
SSH Configuration Auditor
(ssh-audit.com)<http://ht/
tps%3A%2F%2Fwww.ssh-audit.com%2F&data=05%7C02%7CBrent.Kimberley%40Durh
am.ca%7C8eddde16708448e6cdb008dc2d907d49%7C52d7c9c2d54941b69b1f9da198d
c3f16%7C0%7C0%7C638435345797172606%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4
wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&s
data=ydwY2y5%2FxuZxJavbNQw877yOmuFuVo3DktJr%2FdFA05A%3D&reserved=0>
TLS example upon request.

THIS MESSAGE IS FOR THE USE OF THE INTENDED RECIPIENT(S) ONLY AND MAY CONTAIN INFORMATION THAT IS PRIVILEGED, PROPRIETARY, CONFIDENTIAL, AND/OR EXEMPT FROM DISCLOSURE UNDER ANY RELEVANT PRIVACY LEGISLATION. No rights to any privilege have been waived. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, re-transmission, dissemination, distribution, copying, conversion to hard copy, taking of action in reliance on or other use of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient and have received this message in error, please notify me by return e-mail and delete or destroy all copies of this message.

[Brent Kimberley]

To the best of my knowledge" Krb5i provides integrity whereas Krb5p provides confidentiality, integrity, and replay protection.

"Walk tool" finding could map to a radar chart.

In other news, Matthew Palko plans to modernize authentication.
https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/windows-it-pro-blog/the-evolution-of-windows-authentication/ba-p/3926848


-----Original Message-----
From: Brent Kimberley
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2024 2:20 PM
To: Christopher D. Clausen <***@acm.org>; ***@mit.edu
Subject: RE: Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry

Hi Christopher.

Yes. You are correct. Peer reviewed installation readiness documents like the CIS MIT benchmark are a good "first step."

I was asking pointers to the rest of the lifecycle suite - specifically "walk".

Crawl
=====
Installation readiness documents
e.g., CIS MIT Kerberos Benchmark

Walk
====
Focused applications.

Application which can connect to a client or a server and emit:
Enabled ciphers.
Enabled MACs.
Enabled Kerberos modes (krb5, krb5i, krb5p)
etc.

Background: most sites appear to be misconfigured.

Run
====
A focused service.


-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher D. Clausen <***@acm.org>
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2024 2:10 PM
To: Brent Kimberley <***@Durham.ca>; ***@mit.edu
Subject: Re: Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry

[You don't often get email from ***@acm.org. Learn why this is important at https://aka.ms/LearnAboutSenderIdentification ]

I have used this as a guide, but I think MIT Kerberos version 1.10 is the latest available:
https://www.cisecurity.org/benchmark/mit_kerberos

Not sure if this is what you are looking for or not.

<<CDC

Post by Brent Kimberley
Preferably something smaller and more focused than nmap or OpenSCAP. 😉
From: Brent Kimberley
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2024 12:44 PM
Subject: Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry
Hi.
Can anyone point me to some methods to benchmark and/or audit Kerberos v5?
Manual
Read the RFCs and specs.
Semi-automatic.
jtesta/ssh-audit: SSH server & client security auditing (banner, key exchange, encryption, mac, compression, compatibility, security, etc) (github.com)<https://github.com/jtesta/ssh-audit/>
Automatic
SSH Configuration Auditor
(ssh-audit.com)<http://ht/
tps%3A%2F%2Fwww.ssh-audit.com%2F&data=05%7C02%7CBrent.Kimberley%40Durh
am.ca%7C8eddde16708448e6cdb008dc2d907d49%7C52d7c9c2d54941b69b1f9da198d
c3f16%7C0%7C0%7C638435345797172606%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4
wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&s
data=ydwY2y5%2FxuZxJavbNQw877yOmuFuVo3DktJr%2FdFA05A%3D&reserved=0>
TLS example upon request.

THIS MESSAGE IS FOR THE USE OF THE INTENDED RECIPIENT(S) ONLY AND MAY CONTAIN INFORMATION THAT IS PRIVILEGED, PROPRIETARY, CONFIDENTIAL, AND/OR EXEMPT FROM DISCLOSURE UNDER ANY RELEVANT PRIVACY LEGISLATION. No rights to any privilege have been waived. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, re-transmission, dissemination, distribution, copying, conversion to hard copy, taking of action in reliance on or other use of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient and have received this message in error, please notify me by return e-mail and delete or destroy all copies of this message.

[Brent Kimberley]

Minor comment the CIS Benchmark appears to have been written from the system administrator's frame of reference - not the network frame of reference (FoR).
Typically, each frame of reference (FoR) needs to be audited. Hence the need for automation.

-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher D. Clausen <***@acm.org>
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2024 2:10 PM
To: Brent Kimberley <***@Durham.ca>; ***@mit.edu
Subject: Re: Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry

[You don't often get email from ***@acm.org. Learn why this is important at https://aka.ms/LearnAboutSenderIdentification ]

I have used this as a guide, but I think MIT Kerberos version 1.10 is the latest available:
https://www.cisecurity.org/benchmark/mit_kerberos

Not sure if this is what you are looking for or not.

<<CDC

Post by Brent Kimberley
Preferably something smaller and more focused than nmap or OpenSCAP. 😉
From: Brent Kimberley
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2024 12:44 PM
Subject: Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry
Hi.
Can anyone point me to some methods to benchmark and/or audit Kerberos v5?
Manual
Read the RFCs and specs.
Semi-automatic.
jtesta/ssh-audit: SSH server & client security auditing (banner, key exchange, encryption, mac, compression, compatibility, security, etc) (github.com)<https://github.com/jtesta/ssh-audit/>
Automatic
SSH Configuration Auditor
(ssh-audit.com)<http://ht/
tps%3A%2F%2Fwww.ssh-audit.com%2F&data=05%7C02%7CBrent.Kimberley%40Durh
am.ca%7C8eddde16708448e6cdb008dc2d907d49%7C52d7c9c2d54941b69b1f9da198d
c3f16%7C0%7C0%7C638435345797172606%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4
wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&s
data=ydwY2y5%2FxuZxJavbNQw877yOmuFuVo3DktJr%2FdFA05A%3D&reserved=0>
TLS example upon request.

THIS MESSAGE IS FOR THE USE OF THE INTENDED RECIPIENT(S) ONLY AND MAY CONTAIN INFORMATION THAT IS PRIVILEGED, PROPRIETARY, CONFIDENTIAL, AND/OR EXEMPT FROM DISCLOSURE UNDER ANY RELEVANT PRIVACY LEGISLATION. No rights to any privilege have been waived. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, re-transmission, dissemination, distribution, copying, conversion to hard copy, taking of action in reliance on or other use of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient and have received this message in error, please notify me by return e-mail and delete or destroy all copies of this message.

[Ken Hornstein]

Post by Brent Kimberley
Minor comment the CIS Benchmark appears to have been written from the
system administrator's frame of reference - not the network frame of
reference (FoR). Typically, each frame of reference (FoR) needs to be
audited. Hence the need for automation.

I can only say this:

- I've been doing Kerberos for a few decades (but I'm certainly not the
person with the most Kerberos experience on this list).
- I've done a ton of security accreditation work at my $DAYJOB, which
also involves Kerberos. As part of the accrediation work we (and
others) do automated scanning that includes the Kerberos servers
and this seems to satisfy the powers that be. Some of the scanning
seems to detect Kerberos but I am unclear how much it actually checks
for other than "Kerberos is found".
- I've used the aforementioned CIS Benchmark.
- I really have no clue what you mean by "frame of reference" in this
context, and this corresponds to no security accreditation or auditing
requirements I have ever encountered so I cannot provide any
suggestions; I'm really unclear what you are asking for.

--Ken

[Brent Kimberley]

Ken.
The term Frame of Reference is a Cyber Physical system (CPS) term.

For those who work in the cyber subset, the term is "interface".

Regardless of what you call it.

You take the system diagram and evaluate using each major interface or Frame of Reference.

The STIG or CIS benchmark is just one of the interfaces evaluated.


-------------

Post by Brent Kimberley
Minor comment the CIS Benchmark appears to have been written from the
system administrator's frame of reference - not the network frame of
reference (FoR). Typically, each frame of reference (FoR) needs to be
audited. Hence the need for automation.

I can only say this:

- I've been doing Kerberos for a few decades (but I'm certainly not the
person with the most Kerberos experience on this list).
- I've done a ton of security accreditation work at my $DAYJOB, which
also involves Kerberos. As part of the accrediation work we (and
others) do automated scanning that includes the Kerberos servers
and this seems to satisfy the powers that be. Some of the scanning
seems to detect Kerberos but I am unclear how much it actually checks
for other than "Kerberos is found".
- I've used the aforementioned CIS Benchmark.
- I really have no clue what you mean by "frame of reference" in this
context, and this corresponds to no security accreditation or auditing
requirements I have ever encountered so I cannot provide any
suggestions; I'm really unclear what you are asking for.

--Ken

-----Original Message-----
From: Brent Kimberley
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2024 3:24 PM
To: Christopher D. Clausen <***@acm.org>; ***@mit.edu
Subject: RE: Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry

Minor comment the CIS Benchmark appears to have been written from the system administrator's frame of reference - not the network frame of reference (FoR).
Typically, each frame of reference (FoR) needs to be audited. Hence the need for automation.

-----Original Message-----
From: Christopher D. Clausen <***@acm.org>
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2024 2:10 PM
To: Brent Kimberley <***@Durham.ca>; ***@mit.edu
Subject: Re: Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry

[You don't often get email from ***@acm.org. Learn why this is important at https://aka.ms/LearnAboutSenderIdentification ]

I have used this as a guide, but I think MIT Kerberos version 1.10 is the latest available:
https://www.cisecurity.org/benchmark/mit_kerberos

Not sure if this is what you are looking for or not.

<<CDC

Post by Brent Kimberley
Preferably something smaller and more focused than nmap or OpenSCAP. 😉
From: Brent Kimberley
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2024 12:44 PM
Subject: Protocol benchmarking / auditing inquiry
Hi.
Can anyone point me to some methods to benchmark and/or audit Kerberos v5?
Manual
Read the RFCs and specs.
Semi-automatic.
jtesta/ssh-audit: SSH server & client security auditing (banner, key exchange, encryption, mac, compression, compatibility, security, etc) (github.com)<https://github.com/jtesta/ssh-audit/>
Automatic
SSH Configuration Auditor
(ssh-audit.com)<http://ht/
tps%3A%2F%2Fwww.ssh-audit.com%2F&data=05%7C02%7CBrent.Kimberley%40Durh
am.ca%7C8eddde16708448e6cdb008dc2d907d49%7C52d7c9c2d54941b69b1f9da198d
c3f16%7C0%7C0%7C638435345797172606%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4
wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&s
data=ydwY2y5%2FxuZxJavbNQw877yOmuFuVo3DktJr%2FdFA05A%3D&reserved=0>
TLS example upon request.

THIS MESSAGE IS FOR THE USE OF THE INTENDED RECIPIENT(S) ONLY AND MAY CONTAIN INFORMATION THAT IS PRIVILEGED, PROPRIETARY, CONFIDENTIAL, AND/OR EXEMPT FROM DISCLOSURE UNDER ANY RELEVANT PRIVACY LEGISLATION. No rights to any privilege have been waived. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any review, re-transmission, dissemination, distribution, copying, conversion to hard copy, taking of action in reliance on or other use of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient and have received this message in error, please notify me by return e-mail and delete or destroy all copies of this message.

[Ken Hornstein]

This approach is taught in first year engineering.

Geez dude, no need to drag me; I'll be the first one to admit that I'm old
and don't know everything! Back in my day our curriculums didn't cover
any computer security topics at all.

But I stand by my original statements: I, personally, have not encountered
those terms before and I've feel it's fair to say I've done a large amount
of accreditation and audit work and some of it involves Kerberos. And
even with your followup emails I'm still unclear what you are asking for.
Is this because I am old and don't know everything? Certainly! Maybe
it's like Zero Trust Security and I am already mostly doing it. Maybe
it's something we have never been asked to do, so I've never done it
(because in the accreditation world you don't seem to get extra credit
for doing stuff that the accreditors do not ask for).

--Ken

[pyllyukko]

Ehlo.

Post by Brent Kimberley
Can anyone point me to some methods to benchmark and/or audit Kerberos v5?

A short while ago I submitted a PR[1] for the Lynis project that does
something like that. I also started documenting some of my own Kerberos
hardening stuff here[2].

Disclaimer: I'm quite new to Kerberos, so I might be off with some of
the hardenings, so all additional pointers/corrections are more than
welcome.

[1] https://github.com/CISOfy/lynis/pull/1456
[2] https://github.com/pyllyukko/harden.yml/wiki/Kerberos_hardening_and_maintenance